Archive | August 3rd, 2011

Zioni$t Darling Mu-Barak Trial : Silence a European offical and Media attention

NOVANEWS

 

                                       Zioni$t puppet Ho$ni Mu-Barak

I was delighted to see that darling of the Zionists regime behind bars.  I could hear Zionist sobbing in the background.   But it is funny how the man who always appeared in vigorous health suddenly became weak and incapacitated as soon as he was overthrown.  It seems he is still dying his hair.

But don’t be fooled: I worry that his appearance today was intended to appease angry Egyptians and then to abort a real trial for all his crimes against the Egyptian people.  Pressures on the Military Council should be sustained.  Tantawi was not going to let Mu-Barak appear in court if the demonstrated did not start chanting for Tantawi’s overthrow weeks ago.

He got the message and had to comply.  The symbolism of the images are enormous: the images are being shared on Arabic twitter and Facebook with great jubilation.

Madrid ‘Arab Jerusalem’: European governments committed themselves to silence on the trial of deposed Zioni$t puppet Ho$ni Mu-Barak, seen as the trial of the century, while the European press has focused largely on the responses of the Arab street, mainly Egyptian, while he asked readers in the digital Taaliqhm Arab leader who will appear before the next eliminate his country on charges of violation of rights of human and looting of public money. 

And I called ‘Al Quds Al Arabi’ via e-mail more than one Court of media belonging to the Ministries of Foreign Affairs of the European attempt to determine the reaction and whether this will be the trial place of issuance of a statement that did not reach any reply completely, including the statement confirms the quotation to a fair trial.

Zioni$t puppet Mu-Barak was considered a key ally of the West and the European Union, especially France in the Middle East, but has chosen Paris as president of the Union for the Mediterranean silent. Being the same thing in Spain, observers wonder in Madrid, how would affect the trial of Spain, so that a key witness in the trial of Mu-Barak and his son Gamal is a ‘businessman’, Salem is under arrest in this European country on charges of money laundering as a citizen of Spanish and rejects Madrid delivery to eliminate the Egyptian. The Salem is the economic arm of Zioni$t Ho$ni Mu-Barak and his family. 

And the diplomat out of Moorish work in the European Commission that the Europeans, the EU is trying to bypass relationships that were compiled by Arab leaders in the past, especially those who finished politically, such as Zioni$t puppet Mu-=Barak toppled and his Tunisian counterpart Zine El Abidine Ben Ali as well on others, such as those who continue in the interim government as is the case in Libya, Yemen and Syria. The source asserts that these relations in the past were not Location deadline for democratic countries such as European because of its support for dictatorial regimes, where she wants to paradox and irony that the leader of the most prominent European project towards the Arab world, a Union for the Mediterranean, all of Zioni$t puppet Mu-Barak and Zioni$t puppet Zine El Abidine Ben Ali. 

In practice, Vojendh Envoy EU Special Spring Arab, Bernardino Leon include a basis to work on improving relations and the image of Europe and to provide aid to the states through the democratic transition and assistance to democratic movements and not address the issues of the past. 
and against official silence of Europe, has given the European press, including Italian, French and Spanish, an important aspect of an event the trial in of print, electronic and occupied the trial, the first page of the newspaper Le Monde in its evening edition, as it appears Zioni$t Mu-Barak’s image behind bars a criminal dangerous. 

And involved major newspapers such as El Pais and Le Figaro and La Stampa and Libération and El Mundo and Koreans Dalisseera in the titles highlight the importance of this trial on the psyche of the Arab rulers who fear a similar fate on the one hand On the other hand on the psyche of the Arab street, which will form the new fuel to the protests by giving young people Ooxegina overtime. 
participated comments Digital readers of the websites mentioned on this event in the question of who will be ruling the coming Arab League, which will appear before Qsae his country on charges of murder and looting of public money Then you will be European leaders among the witnesses as long as many of them involved politically and financially with some of these Arab leaders.

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Check The Label – Boycott Zionist Dates

NOVANEWS

This Ramadan, Don’t Break your Fast with an IsraHell Date

Ramadan is a time of year when we remember those who are less fortunate than ourselves.  It  would be an affront if at such a time we helped support oppression

Every year, IsraHell exports millions of pounds worth of dates to the world, which many people unknowingly buy and use to break their fasts. These dates are grown in illegal settlements in the West Bank and the Jordan Valley, on land that has been stolen from Palestinians. By buying these dates, we are in fact helping Israel to continue its occupation and oppression of the Palestinian people.

For this reason, Friends of Al Aqsa will again be launching the ‘Check the Label’ Campaign.

Volunteer Ambassador

Volunteer to be an ambassador for the Check the Label Campaign in your area. This will mean you will help promote the campaign in your area. This will include distributing leaflets, speaking to shop owners, setting up stalls and much more. become an Ambassador and order your free literature to help spread the word.

Check The Label

Most of the major supermarkets will stock dates produced in Israel, West Bank and the Jordan Valley. Dates produced in the West Bank and the Jordan Valley are from Illegal IsraHell Settlements and should also be boycotted.
Check The Label postcard back

Making Money from the Occupation

– Dates were IsraHell’s leading fruit export, most of which come to Europe

– The total income for IsraHell from dates in a year is approximately €80 million.

Check The Label cartoon strip

You can order your FREE Check The Label literature here

 

The Palestinian Call for Boycott Divestment and Sanctions

Inspired by the struggle of South Africans against apartheid and in the spirit of international solidarity, moral consistency and resistance to injustice and oppression,

We, representatives of Palestinian civil society, call upon international civil society organizations and people of conscience all over the world to impose broad boycotts and implement divestment initiatives against IsraHell similar to those applied to South Africa in the apartheid era. We appeal to you to pressure your respective states to impose embargoes and sanctions against IsraHell.

We also invite conscientious IsraHellis to support this Call, for the sake of justice and genuine peace.

These non-violent punitive measures should be maintained until IsraHell meets its obligation to recognize the Palestinian peoples inalienable right to self-determination and fully complies with the precepts of international law by:

1. Ending its occupation and colonization of all Arab lands and dismantling the Wall;
2. Recognizing the fundamental rights of the Arab-Palestinian citizens of IsraHell to full equality; and
3. Respecting, protecting and promoting the rights of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes and properties as stipulated in UN resolution 194.

Click here for the full text and endorsements

Palestinian Workers

IsraHellis will claim that Palestinians are allowed to work on the land of these settlers and therefore they are provided with jobs and a boycott will harm them. In actual fact, these Palestinians are employed for paltry wages, and they are required to do the back-breaking work that the IsraHelli settlers will not do themselves. This means the IsraHelli settlers reap the rewards for the harvests while doing very little of the work themselves.

Palestinian children are employed by these settlers, and they are forced to work long hours under a hot baking sun for small sums of money. This exploitation means that these children miss out on an education.

Alternatives to IsraHelli Dates

There are plenty of varieties of dates from various other countries to break your fast. However if you would like  Medjoul dates from Palestine and  help the Palestinian farmers they are available from  YAFFA. YAFFA source there dates from Palestine and FOA are helping YAFFA distribute dates this Ramadhan.

Another provider is Zaytoun, www.zaytoun.org.uk

Get Involved

There are two stages to this campaign:

Stage 1 – Contact and inform the wholesalers and shops.

Stage 2 – Contact and inform consumers.

Stage One

FOA have sent letters to over 1000 wholesalers and shops but we need your help to add the personal touch as that is the best method to encourage people to join the campaign.

There are 6 steps to this stage. We would like you to:

Preparation:

1.      If you can try and involve family and friends in the campaign.

2.      Print letters for Wholesalers and Shop Owners: Click here for the letter.

3.      Order Check the Label posters and postcards fromdates@checkthelabel.org.uk so you can put poster up on shop windows and leave postcards on the counter (with permission)

Method:

1.      Identify the wholesalers, importers and shops in your area hand deliver the wholesaler/shop letters supplied by FOA.  Inform them about Israeli human rights abuses (you can give them of FOA leaflets).

2.      Tell wholesalers and shop owners about the concept of boycotting and how it has worked e.g. South Africa. Ask them to boycott dates from IsraHell, West Bank and the Jordan Valley. Explain West Bank and Jordan Valley are illegally occupied and buying dates from there would mean they are supporting the occupation of Palestine.

3.      Let them know that they can buy dates from many other countries, but if they want to buy medjoul dates from Palestine they can contact

medjoul@checkthelabel.org.uk,

0116 2125 441

Zaytoun on: 0207 609 5699

4.      Keep in touch with the shops that you have approached and continue to encourage and support them to join the campaign.

5.      Write down addresses of shops which agree to support the campaign so we can write a letter to them to thank them for their support.

6.      Take pictures of the campaign and keep head office updated on your work in your locality.

Stage Two

Most of the people we have approached during the Check the Label campaign did not know dates are from IsraHell and also did not know that dates labelled West Bank or the Jordan Valley should also be Boycotted.   Once they were told, the overwhelming majority of people were happy to join the boycott.

Boycott is about people power.  We need your help to inform people they should ‘Check the Label’ and boycott dates from IsraHell, West Bank and Jordan Valley.

Preparation:

1.      If you can try and involve family and friends in the campaign.

2.      Print letters for mosques and organisations : Click here for the letter

3.      Order Check the Label posters and postcards from here so you can put poster up on shop windows and leave postcards on the counter (with permission).

Method:

1.      Identify Mosques and Community Centres in your area and hand deliver the Mosque/organisation letter supplied by FOA.  Inform them about Israeli human rights abuses (you can give them of FOA leaflets).

2.      Tell the mosque/ community centre contact about the concept of boycotting and how it has worked e.g. South Africa. Ask them to boycott dates from IsraHell, West Bank and the Jordan Valley. Explain West Bank and Jordan Valley are illegally occupied and buying dates from there would mean they are supporting the occupation of Palestine.

3.      Ask them if you can leave leaflets at the entrance and put up a poster

4.      Organise a time with friends and family to distribute outside the mosque after prayers, especially after Friday prayers.

5.      Let FOA know when you are planning to distribute outside mosques so we can try and co-ordinate with other volunteers.

6.      Contact your local newspaper and your local radio Ramadhan to let them know what is happening. Take photos when it is appropriate  and send updates to:

info@checkthelabel.org.uk

Free Campaign Literature

Check The Label    Check The Label poster       Check The Label postcard1    Check The Label cartoon strip

Check the Label Campaign Video

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Egypt independent trade unions endorse BDS

NOVANEWS

by Egyptian Independent Union Federation

Press release
London, 2 July 2011

Representative of the Egyptian Independent Union Federation: “We call on the global trade union movement to cut links with the Histadrut and to support the Palestinian Trade Union Coalition for BDS”.

Kamal Abu Aita, representative of the Egyptian Independent Union Federation (EIUF) which was recently formed in Tahrir Square during the revolution, confirmed yesterday that the EIUF rejects any attempt to “normalise” relations with Israel. In a speech in London to hundreds of activists from the campaign for Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions (BDS) against Israel, Abu Aita also welcomed the formation of the Palestinian Trade Union Coalition for BDS (PTUC-BDS) and called on the international trade union movement to join the coalition.

Abu Aita said: “The Egyptian Independent Union Federation has a very clear position and that is one of solidarity with the Palestinian Arab people, support for their right to a state in the whole of their land and support for their right to use all forms of resistance against the Zionist state. The EIUF announces its rejection of all forms of normal relations with the racist, settler Zionist state and we will not co-operate with any of its official or trade union bodies because they are all connected to the Zionist occupation of our land. It is impossible for us to work with this racist regime, and it is vital to build a movement of humanity which aims to get rid of racist regimes against the world, just as we got rid of the Apartheid regime in South Africa.

The Egyptian revolution opened the door wide for our people to express their rejection of the Zionist state. From the beginning, the revolution has worked in the interests of the Palestinians, by stopping the export of Egyptian gas to the Zionists, and opening the border crossings. Egyptian youth besieged the embassy of our enemy and demanded the expulsion of the ambassador.

We reject any relationship with the Histadrut because it is part of this racist regime. We call on all friendly unions to boycott the Histadrut as part of the campaign to get rid of racist regimes all over the world.”

Omar Barghouti, one of the founders of the Palestinian Campaign for the Academic and Cultural Boycott of Israel (PACBI), said:

“The support of the Egyptian independent unions, represented by their federation, for the Palestinian Boycott Campaign is a source of pride for us, just as we are proud of Egypt’s leadership in the march of freedom from imperialism both old and new. We look forward to the return of the spirit to all the Arab peoples struggling for freedom and social justice, and to break away from dependency on imperialist domination.”

http://www.arabawy.org/2011/07/07/egypt-independent-trade-unions-endorse-bds/

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Palestinian Trade Union Coalition for BDS (PTUC-BDS)

NOVANEWS

Statement of Principles & Call for International Trade Union Support for BDS

Occupied Palestine, 4 May 2011 – In commemoration of the first of May – a day of workers struggle and international solidarity – the first Palestinian trade union conference for boycotts, divestment and sanctions against Israel (BDS) was held in Ramallah on 30 April 2011, organized by almost the entirety of the Palestinian trade union movement, including federations, professional unions, and trade union blocks representing the entire spectrum of Palestinian political parties.

The conference marked a historic event: the formation of the Palestinian Trade Union Coalition for BDS (PTUC-BDS) as the largest coalition of the Palestinian trade union movementPTUC-BDSwill provide the most representative Palestinian reference for international trade unions, promoting their support for and endorsement of the BDS Call, launched by Palestinian civil society in 2005, guided by the guidelines and principles adopted by the Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions National Committee (BNC), of which PTUC-BDS has become a key component.

The global trade union movement has always played a key and inspiring role in its courageous commitment to human rights and adoption of concrete, ground-breaking, labor-led sanctions against oppressive regimes in a show of solidarity with oppressed peoples around the world. The trade union boycott of apartheid South Africa stands out as a bright example of this tradition of effective solidarity. Trade unions today are taking the lead in defending the Palestinian people’s right to self-determination, justice, freedom, equality and the right of return of our refugees as stipulated in United Nations General Assembly Resolution 194. Many of them have heeded the call from Palestinian civil society, and its labor movement in particular, to adopt BDS as the most effective form of solidarity with the Palestinians in our struggle to end Israeli occupation and apartheid.

Ending Israel’s multi-tiered system of oppression against the Palestinian people — comprising occupation, colonialism and apartheid — has become a test for humanity. For decades, Israel has enjoyed impunity while continuing its gradual ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, particularly in occupied East Jerusalem, the Jordan Valley and the Naqab (Negev) desert; its 44-year-old occupation; its theft of land and natural resources; its colonization and construction of illegal colonial settlements and walls, its siege of Gaza;  its relentless denial of refugee rights; its endless wars of aggressions and incarceration of political prisoners; and its wanton killings of civilians and demolition of infrastructure.

Israel’s systematic destruction of the Palestinian economy, expropriation of the most fertile agricultural land, as well as humiliation of and racist discrimination against Palestinian workers have all become part of its apartheid reality that should never be tolerated by the world today.

Given the complete failure and unwillingness of hegemonic powers to hold Israel accountable to international law, it is up to people of conscience and international civil society, especially the trade union movement, to take concrete action to end international collusion with decades of violations of international law and human rights by Israel, its institutions and international corporations.

The support of the entirety of the Palestinian trade union movement for a full boycott of Israel,[1] as the most effective form of solidarity with the Palestinian people, was the overarching message of this historic gathering.

The Conference was honored to welcome Joâo Felicio, International Relations Secretary of CUT, the Brazilian trade union representing more than 20 million workers, who expressed solidarity with the Palestinian people and their legitimate rights, and reiterated CUT’s endorsement of BDS. The conference received numerous messages of solidarity from a large number of trade union federations, including the International Federation of Arab Trade Unions, COSATU (South Africa), ICTU (Ireland), and a large number of individual trade unions in Canada, Scotland, Italy, France, Spain, Turkey, Australia, USA and other countries. All major Palestinian political parties also enthusiastically supported the conference and the formation of PTUC-BDS.

The Conference decisively condemned the Histadrut and called on international trade unions to sever all links with it due to its historic and current complicity in Israel’s violations of international law and Palestinian rights. The Histadrut has always played a key role in perpetuating Israel’s occupation, colonization and system of racial discrimination by:

  1. Publicly supporting Israel’s violations of the Fourth Geneva Convention and other tenets of international law

  2. Maintaining active commercial interests in Israel’s illegal settlement enterprise[2]

  3. Allowing Jewish settlers in the occupied West Bank to join the organization[3]

  4. Supporting Israel’s war of aggression on besieged Gaza in 2008/9;[4] it has later justified Israel’s massacre of humanitarian relief workers and activists aboard the Freedom Flotilla on 31 May 2010[5]

  5. Illegally withholding over NIS 8.3 billion (approximately $2.43bn) over decades of occupation from wages earned by Palestinian workers from the Occupied Palestinian Territory,[6] deducted for ‘social and other trade union benefits’ that Palestinian laborers from the OPT have never received.

Recalling the trade union maxim “an injury to one is an injury to all”, and given the global trade union movement’s historic role in effective international solidarity with oppressed peoples around the world, PTUC-BDS:

  • Cordially salutes all global trade unions for their solidarity with the Palestinian people, especially those that have endorsed BDS against Israel,

  • Calls on trade unions around the world to actively show solidarity with the Palestinian people by implementing creative and context-sensitive BDS campaigns as the most effective way to end Israeli impunity. For example by:

    • boycotting Israeli and international companies (such as Elbit, Agrexco, Veolia, Alstom, Caterpillar, Northrop Grumman, etc.) and institutions that are complicit with Israel’s occupation and violations of international law,

    • reviewing pension fund investments with the purpose of divesting from Israel Bonds and all Israeli and international companies and institutions complicit in Israel’s occupation, colonization and apartheid,

    • pressuring governments to suspend Free Trade Agreements, end arms trade and military relations with Israel with the intention of eventually cutting all diplomatic ties with it,

  • Calls on port workers around the world to boycott loading/offloading Israeli ships, similar to the heroic step taken by port workers around the world in suspending maritime trade with South Africa in protest against the apartheid regime, and

  • Calls on trade unions around the world to review and sever all ties with the Histadrut.

Such non-violent measures of accountability must continue until Israel fulfils its obligations under international law in acknowledging the Palestinian people’s inalienable right to self-determination, and fully complies with international law by:

  • Ending its occupation and colonization of all Arab lands occupied since 1967 (including East Jerusalem), as well as dismantling of the illegal wall and colonies,

  • Recognizing the fundamental right of the Palestinian citizens of Israel to full equity, as well as ending the system of racial discrimination against them, and

  • Respecting, protecting and supporting the rights of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes and properties as stipulated in UNGA Resolution 194.

The Palestinian Trade Union Coalition for BDS (PTUC-BDS) is the broadest and most representative body of the Palestinian trade union movement and includes the following organisations: General Union of Palestinian Workers, Federation of Independent Trade Unions (IFU), General Union of Palestinian Women, Union of Palestinian Professional Associations (comprising the professional syndicates of Engineers, Physicians, Pharmacists, AgriculturalEngineers, Lawyers, Dentists and Veterinarians), General Union of Palestinian Teachers, General Union of Palestinian Peasants and Co-ops, General Union of Palestinian Writers, Union of Palestinian Farmers, Palestinian Federation of Unions of University Professors and Employees (PFUUPE), Union of Public Employees in Palestine-Civil Sector; and all of the trade union blocksthat make up the Palestine General Federation of Trade Unions (PGFTU): Central Office for the Workers Movement, Progressive Labor Union Front, Workers Unity block, Progressive Workers Block, Workers solidarity organization, Workers Struggle Block, workers resistance block, Workers Liberation Front, Union of Palestinian Workers Struggle Committees, National Initiative (al-Mubadara) Block.

– Palestinian Trade Union Coalition for BDS (PTUC-BDS)
ptuc-bds@bdsmovement.net

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Media War: Atzmon vs Greenstein

NOVANEWS

Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2011 03:15:11 +0100
From: tonygreenstein@yahoo.com

To: Ken O’Keefe

Subject: Atzmon

Ken

I’m surprised that I even have to write to you about this. From memory you once wrote to me saying that you had no time for Atzmon yet here you are on a bill with him.

In case this is all strange to you, I am posting a link to my ‘Guide to Atzmon’
It is interesting that in Germany of all places Atzmon titles his talk History, Truth and Integrity because in his essay Truth, History and Integrity he writes that

‘If, for instance, the Nazis wanted the Jews out of their Reich (Judenrein – free of Jews), or even dead, as the Zionist narrative insists, how come they marched hundreds of thousands of them back into the Reich at the end of the war?’ [my emphasis – TG] ‘If the Nazis ran a death factory in Auschwitz-Birkenau, why would the Jewish prisoners join them at the end of the war? [my emphasis – TG] ‘We should ask for some conclusive historical evidence and arguments rather than follow a religious narrative…’ ‘Why were the Jews hated? Why did European people stand up against their next-door neighbours? Why are the Jews hated in the Middle East.’

When Atzmon talks about ‘freedom of speech’ he is not talking about the silencing of Palestinian voices vs Zionism, which as you will be aware, I tried to combat with the petition about the BBC coverage last year, but about holocaust denial. The above quote ‘if the Nazis ran a death factory in Auschwitz-Birkenau’ says everything about his real agenda.

I would urge you to think very carefully about this as it will only legitimise someone who actually is anti-Semitic. The fact that 99% of the times the Zionists label someone anti-Zionist as anti-Semitic doesn’t mean there aren’t some anti-Semites of the traditional variety around (albeit most of them, like the Norwegian bomber are mainly pro-Israel these days).

best

Tony Greenstein

On 27 Jul 2011, at 19:23,

Dr. Gabi Weber wrote:

Dear Mr. Greenstein

my name is Dr. Gabi Weber. I am the head of Cafe Palestine Freiburg and the main organizer of Freiburg Conference on September 11th.

Today I found out that the dirty war you are fighting in vain against Gilad Atzmon for years now, is spilling over to Germany.

One day after the conference was announced, your bad games started again. You try to bother my speakers and you even do not hesitate to spread your lies to our young Palestinian musician, Moamen Khatib. Probably you didn´t realise that you didn´t only send the text adressed to Moamen but also the correspondence you had concerning Moamen being “young and gullible”. It is really disgusting!

I know that it is not the first time that you try to jeopardize an event with Gilad Atzmon – whether it is supposed to happen in Germany, Switzerland or other countries. To reach your obvious “aim in life” you don´t hesitate to lie, to commit forgery, to take “quotes” out of their context and put them together in a wrong order and so on. I am also in posession of interesting documents that testify Mr. Greenstein´s criminal past.

Recently I learned that xxx tried to stop singer and musician Amal Murkus and the Palestinian delegation in London who organised the Palestinian event “From Al Tahrir to Jerusalem”. She tried to do a “counter-event” under the similar name as the “Al Tahrir”- event.

Having a lot of information about your sick “movement” I could respond to each of the false sentences xxx is writing to Moamen.

But I prefer to let you know that from now on, I will record and spread every single attempt from your side to destroy the conference.

Perhaps you didn´t realise by now. I am distributing all kinds of news about Palestine to thousands of adresses I have in my internet list. My newsletters are spread by others and this not only in Germany. What you should also know is, that I have hundreds of politicians and press adresses in my list. This means that – if I start to publish what is happening around the conference – many people and organisations will finally understand how the so-called “Palestinian solidarity movement” works. And I must admit that I detest the way of action that you dare to call “solidarity for Palestinians”.

I copied all my conference participants as well as other important people as addressee into this email. And I am asking each of them to inform me about any attempt to put pressure on them and to prevent them from joining the conference.

Below you find the email from Mrs. X to Moamen, the correspondence foregoing this mail and also Tony Greenstein´s mail to Ken O´Keefe.

The conference wants to disclose the elements that destroy open discourse. You couldn´t have done better to show everybody how necessary this conference is!

Dr. Gabi Weber

From: tony greenstein

To: ken_okeefe ; Kenneth O’Keefe ken.okeefe@alohapalestine.com>

27th July 19:38

Ken

I e-mailed you early this morning. I hope you got it.

Meanwhile I’ve been sent this message. What is going on? I understand that Atzmon’s ex-friend Mary Rizzo is involved but I know no more than that

Tony

From: Tony Greenstein

27th July 20:05

To: Gaby Weber

Dear Dr Weber,

It would seem that we have touched a raw nerve.

I know nothing of Moamen Khatib. I have no desire to destroy any conference, least of all that on Palestine. However I also do not wish the Palestine solidarity and anti-Zionist movements to be sullied by someone who is an out and out anti-Semite and now a holocaust denier. Atzmon’s primary contribution to the cause is to attack, not Zionists but Jewish anti-Zionists who he defines, by virtue of being Jewish, as Zionists. I think you are very aware of what I am talking about. If not then my Guide to Atzmon will help your understanding, important with someone who is a Doctor.

I think the extract below from ‘Truth History and Integrity’ by Atzmon speaks for itself whatever interpretation you put on it.

The open discourse that you say you don’t want to destroy has nothing to do with Palestine and everything to do with rehabilitation of those who presided over 12 years of fascism in Germany and who exterminated not only Jews, but Gypsies, Gays, Russians and the Disabled. Perhaps free speech for Nazis should be the title of your conference? The real issue is the silencing of Palestinian voices not neo-Nazis.

My past has nothing to do with any of this but all previous, minor convictions, a quarter of a century ago, are all spent. And defrauding bankers doesn’t seem to me much like a crime given they have defrauded everyone else but no doubt ‘justice for bankers’ and wankers is also one of your causes.

In Solidarity

Tony Greenstein

Truth, History, and Integrity

‘If, for instance, the Nazis wanted the Jews out of their Reich (Judenrein – free of Jews), or even dead, as the Zionist narrative insists, how come they marched hundreds of thousands of them back into the Reich at the end of the war?’ [my emphasis – TG] ‘If the Nazis ran a death factory in Auschwitz-Birkenau, why would the Jewish prisoners join them at the end of the war? [my emphasis – TG] ‘We should ask for some conclusive historical evidence and arguments rather than follow a religious narrative…’ ‘Why were the Jews hated? Why did European people stand up against their next-door neighbours? Why are the Jews hated in the Middle East.’

From: tony greenstein

To: ken_okeefe Sent: Wed, 27 July, 2011 20:07:49

Subject: Gabi Weber

It seems I was wrong and that you did indeed respond to my e-mail, but not to me!

I have just had a hysterical e-mail from Gabi Weber which tends to suggest that you are indeed aligned to Atzmon

tony greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: Dr. Gabi Weber

To tony greenstein

Sent: Thu, 28 July, 2011 11:03:52

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

Hello

I really thought that after so many years you would realise spreading all those lies about me, won’t get you anywhere. If anything, it really harms your career and this is indeed a great shame.
Being consumed in envy you clearly missed a great chance to become a world star.

As you may notice, people who are involved professionally in the music business are really careful not to badmouth each other.

It is time for you to become a pro. You certainly posses the musical talent. We are getting older, and as far as I am aware, you live once.

All the best
Gilad

On 28 Jul 2011, at 14:49, tony greenstein wrote:

Gilad Atzmon

The arrogance and malevolence of your post below amply demonstrates why you are a threat to the Palestine solidarity movement. You are worth your weight in gold to Mossad for your divisive effect.

Despite calling for debate on every aspect of the holocaust and WWII, when I challenged you on Unity FM in Birmingham recently you panicked and threatened to walk off the set if Sami Ibrahim allowed me to challenge you once more. http://azvsas.blogspot.com/2011/06/funny-thing-happened-today-as-unity-fm.html Your agenda is quite clear

Tony Greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein

Cc: Dr. Gabi Weber

Sent: Thu, 28 July, 2011 17:10:37

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

Greenstein, I hope that you yourself don’t believe the crap you write, because if you do, you certainly need a professional help.

Interestingly enough, with my academic qualification and my deep understanding of tribal psychosis, I may be the only person who could help you, and believe me, I do my best.

All you have to do, is to keep reading me as you do, and to look in the mirror (as you never do)

ATB

Gilad

On 28 Jul 2011, at 17:59,

tony greenstein wrote:

Atzmon

I certainly don’t need professional help to understgand what you write. A child of five could decipher the ‘deep meanings’.

Your ‘academic qualification’ and deep understanding of ‘tribal psychosis’ (is it a recognised WHO medical impairment?) cannot get you out of the fix you are in.

At least I am able to look in the mirror and see my reflection

Tony Greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein

Cc: Dr. Gabi Weber Sent: Thu, 28 July, 2011 18:43:33

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

You failed the test again,,, You do not need professional help to understand me (everybody does), it is yourself whom you don’t understand.

But as i said, i can help you.

Tell me when you are ready .. it will hurt but its worth it.

On 28 Jul 2011, at 21:25, tony greenstein wrote:

Gilad Atzmon

Thank you for your most recent e-mail. I can understand your concern regarding the Palestine festival in Germany. I have a suggestion for you. Given that you are widely believed to be a holocaust denier and that you politically associate with people like Israel Shamir and Paul Eisen, why don’t you pull out of the Conference in order that there can be no controversy over your appearance?

Surely you know that someone with your reputation, appearing in Germany of all places, on a platform which is apparently designed to oppose the silencing of Palestinian voices in the media, though it looks suspiciously like your real concern is the silencing of neo-Nazis like Ernst Zundel and others who wish to rewrite history, cannot possibly be of any assistance or support to the Palestinians or anti-Zionism?

Why don’t you prove that your purported concern and make a small sacrifice? As for the rest of your e-mail. It’s a sign of your overweening ego and arrogance that you really think you’re the one who sets others with tests. This is not the era of McCarthy.

I agree that most people, not everyone (unless your omnipresent) understand you for what you are, which is a gifted musician, albeit one who is not too careful about attributing the music he uses to those who wrote it, combined with a superficial bigot. It’s called the Bobby Fischer syndrome. Hence why you hide what you are saying beneath a dense undergrowth of pseudo academic prose. You actually don’t want people to understand the implications of what you write.

No one of course fully understands themselves but you demonstrate that you haven’t even begun that process with yourself. Hence why you try to impress people with your second hand observations, masquerading as important insights. The fact that a number of people flatter you whilst understanding barely a word of what you say, only increases your problems.

Accept your help? To what end? Helping you to come to terms with your massive ego and second-rate mind? I’m sorry but even the Good Samaritan would have walked away from that one.

But since you’ve come back for another dose of enlightenment, perhaps you could answer a simple question? Why, on 16th June, when I confronted you in a radio phone-in programme on Unity FM, http://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/gilad-atzmon-with-sammi-ibrahem-unity-fm.html with a few pertinent questions, did you throw a tantrum and issue an ultimatum that you would walk out if Sammi Ibrahem allowed me to put you on the spot again? You, the all-knowing brilliant intellect nearly had a heart attack when you were forced to respond to what were quite simple questions such as how does holocaust denial help the Palestinians? Or why you queried in ‘Truth, History & Integrity’ the existence of Auschwitz as a death camp?

Your outburst was recorded on the tape you so conveniently supplied, but I’d already worked it out on my blog and Sami Ibrahim has since confirmed it, saying he was stunned by your reaction but didn’t know what to do faced with your threatened walk-out. Result that as I was waiting for a second bite of the cherry I listened to Sami was saying there were no callers!

I also found it amusing, but not surprising, when you were asked a straight question on Unity FM, ‘do you accept the holocaust as a fact?’, that you responded you didn’t know if it occurred because you are not a historian. Do you really need to be a historian to know whether something as cataclysmic as the holocaust occurred? Do you need to be a historian to know if the Nakba occurred? Or whether there was a triangular slave trade between Africa, Britain and the Americas? Or the American War of Independence or the Armenian genocide? Your answer, or rather failure to answer, speaks volumes.

Your problem is very simple. You can’t come to terms with either your own stupidity or malevolence.

Tony Greenstein

From: Tony Greenstein

To: Ken O’Keefe

28th July 2011 23:57

Ken,

I have still not had a response from you as to why you will be speaking in Germany alongside someone who is a holocaust denier.

I also mentioned that I had been passed certain rumours regarding yourself. My initial reaction was to ignore them but then I recalled a strange e-mail I received from you at a time when an advert attacking the BBC for its coverage of the Mavi Marmara was being discussed. I ignored it because clearly the money had been raised for different purposes but it nonetheless struck me at the time as very strange.

But if you are prepared to give legitimacy to Gilad Atzmon, despite all he has written, then who knows what you are really thinking.

Tony Greenstein

From: Kenneth O’Keefe

To: tony greenstein <

Sent: Wed, 8 September, 2010 19:34:22

Subject: Re: Update BBC Ad

Aloha Tony,

Please consider the possibility of asking people if they would object to investing this money in www.BPC-World.co.uk. With that money we could pay people to produce an awesome critique of the program and market it so that it would reach a much bigger audience. I only say this because I believe in turning negatives into positives, this is a great chance to seriously blast the BBC and if this idea is of any interest I will spend the time to give more specifics.

TJP,

Ken

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein

Cc: Dr. Gabi Weber

Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 1:13:37 Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

Do you really take yourself seriously,,, do you really think that people who are “widely believed to be a holocaust denier” perform in Germany on regular basis?

Apperntly writing is just another gift you lack… can you try and say it in a single short paragraph? Unlike you, i don’t live on income support.. I am a busy man

On 29 Jul 2011, at 04:14,

tony greenstein wrote:

No need to shout. When I’m writing for the benefit of others then it is important to make one’s point.

I note that you fail to answer any questions but hey, who is surprised?

Being on income support and being busy are not incompatible.

And to develop your ‘mirror’ analogy even further, it would appear that like Caliban, you don’t seem to like what you see.

Give my love to Mary Rizzo

Tony Greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein

Cc: Dr. Gabi Weber

Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 8:25:25

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

I like it when you are short ..

If you want my attention, keep it short..good exercise for you..
you say,

Being on income support and being busy are not incompatible.

they actually are..

it is the all about the difference between being a failure and being a success story.

it also explains the lack of mirroring, the criminal record, the hate crimes against Jews and then your relentless hasbara tricks ..all documentd

Mr Greenstein, you are an exemplary case of tribal ugliness..

In fact We need you, you exhibit everything I say about tribalism and Zionist activism.

You ll read my book soon

I am also happy to send you a review copy in September

From: Dr. Gabi Weber

To: tony greenstein

Cc: Gilad Atzmon

Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 14:12:59

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

Hello Mr. Greenstein,

as physician, working with all kinds of patients for years now, I am used to many different symptoms, diseases, psychological disorders and so on. Fortunately until now I never before was involved in dirty games and tricks as I am experiencing in the emails you are sending for days now. Even the mentally sickest of my patients I ever had, was not as sick as you are!

And to say it clear – KEEP ME OUT OF YOUR MAD INTRIGUES!

My time is too precious to deal with people who are obviously full of hatred, only aiming at destroying other people´s lifes.

Really, I have pity for you. What kind of life must this be, to spend years over years by trying to demolish the career of a person and to see that all the efforts are leading to nothing? On the contrary, the person you try to destroy is getting more and more popular and successful. What a shame for you!
Your behaviour proves exactly, what is happening in the so-called Palestinian Solidarity Movement. We are infiltrated with dirty Hasbara, this is very clear.

Perhaps you should try to find something beautiful for your life? You could try to use your talents, which you certainly have but that you bury under tons of hate and negative energy. Imagine if you simply tried to take all this energy you need for the attempts to destroy Gilad Atzmon and did something positive with it. Perhaps we already would have a Palestinian State?????

As I told you in my last email, I am very attentive in what is happening around my Freiburg conference. In case I get any information of your ongoing attempt to bother my speakers I will start publicizing everything.

Best wishes

Dr. Gabi Weber

Am 29.07.2011 19:30,

schrieb tony greenstein:

Gabi Weber

I am not interested in your role as a doctor. Many people unfortunately get treated by quacks and other charlatans. Clearly your patients fit into that category.

For someone whose time is so precious you seem to do a lot of e-mailing but I’m trying to save your time by having Gilad Atzmon gracefully withdraw from the conference. To save face he could say that he has a conflict of interest being a patient of yours.

And then maybe you could consult a real doctor regarding your symptoms of paranoia

tony greenstein

From: Dr. Gabi Weber

To: tony greenstein

Cc: Gilad Atzmon < Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 20:11:06

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

People like you, Mr. Greenstein, should be put in preventive custody! For your attempt to infamize Gilad Atzmon, who is one of the panelists of Freiburg Conference as well as the attempt to discredit the conference I will take you to court whenever you enter Germany, although being aware that I would not get a penny from you loosing the trial. You are the last person on this planet to tell me, who I am allowed to invite to any event I am planning. Sorry, Mr. Greenstein, you are not the one who I will ever ask for advice.

Dr. Gabi Weber On 29 Jul 2011, at 21:06,

tony greenstein wrote: How interesting ‘Dr’ Weber. I should be put in preventive custody. What an unfortunate phrase but there’s many a slip betwixt cup and lip . ‘Preventive Custody’ was of course the euphemism used for placing Gypsies and other ‘anti-socials’ in concentration camps by the Nazis. (C Browning – Origin of the Final Solution amongst others). Very few of course survived, though according to Atzmon they were probably holiday camps.

I guess it makes sense though. When I first heard of your conference I assumed that you were innocent and naive and didn’t know anything of Atzmon’s racist background. Now it would seem that not only were you aware but you share his opinion, indeed are in advance of them. Do you have any other gems to share with us? tony greenstein On 29 Jul 2011, at 21:16, tony greenstein wrote: Yes u send me a review copy of your book. I doubt any review will be favourable though. Ah yes, being on income support is a sign of criminality is it. Any more reactionary thoughts of the day? I seem to have succeeded very well in spreading the message about you! tony greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein Cc: Dr. Gabi Weber

Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 22:20:52

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!! Being on income support is a symptom of yourself being failure , the criminality is just another symptom.. And The failure of your relentless campaign against me is probably the ultimate symptom.And get guess what, you Don’t get because you are a failure .

From: Gilad Atzmon To: tony greenstein Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 22:55:25

Subject: Re: Atzmon’s Conference Organiser Comes Out in Her True Colours (Re: Stop bothering!!!!)

You do it again, projecting your fantasies on others.. However you are an anti social,, you are a shop lifter, credit card fraudster, vandal, a liar, a stalker ,, did I miss anything? On 29 Jul 2011 at 22:56, tony greenstein wrote: Gilad Atzmon Being judged by you a failure is a sign of success. It depends on your values, of which u would appear to have none. You talk of criminality but you are the biggest fraud of them all, and that is because you are dishonest politically. Robin Hood was no criminal but the Sheriff of Nottingham was. But the Sheriff made the law so it was Robin Hood who was the criminal legally, because the powerful make the law. But for u it is the Bund who were criminals for It is not going to work to Tony’le, you have managed to burn all bridges…

The only man who loves you is me because you prove everything I say… 29th July 23:10 Re: Atzmon’s Conference Organiser Comes Out in Her True Colours (Re: Stop bothering!!!!) …

From: tony greenstein [Chat now]

To: Gilad Atzmon just mad and getting madder

From: Gilad Atzmon To: tony greenstein

Sent: Fri, 29 July, 2011 23:20:00

Subject: Re: Stop bothering!!!!

Too long again remember, I am a busy man,,give it another go… A week with me ll make u into a mench From: tony greenstein [Chat now] Sent: 29th July 23:49 To: Gilad Atzmon not trying to eliminate inconvenient posts are we? learnt your trade well I see

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein Cc: Dr. Gabi Gabi Weber

Sent: Sat, 30 July, 2011 0:38:32

Subject: here is an offer I imagine anything is too long 4 you. Your brain is addled. Hence y u cannot answer a simple question re being a historian G: You are wrong, you simply get carried away, and i am not as sympathetic as you like me to be,,I really prefer to write a good paper then reading your endless ranting… However, here is an offer for you.. submit 10 questions. in a respectable format..

Short questions, in an orderly manner.. you can ask anything you like, Holocaust, Nakba , Shamir, my IDF history, all the things that concern you I will do the same, I will a From: Gilad Atzmon On 30 Jul 2011, at 00:56, tony greenstein wrote: there you go again. You assume that I am curious or concerned about your past. G: you are a coward, you blame me for not answering your ‘simple questions ‘ and then … run away.. this is why you are a failure… Tony,, this is why no one publishes you, not even your old friends… I know more than enough about you to know that you don’t give straight answers as you demonstrated with the response to a simple question on radio – did the holocaust occur. You could have said yes or no rather than hiding behind the ‘I’m not a historian’ excuse. Just because u r obsessed by yourself it doesn’t mean that others are. G: being my leading stalker, this is the best joke you have ever produced yes you’re more popular than the Palestinians. Who knows. Maybe that’s the way to victory! Quite what they’ve done to deserve your ‘support’ is another question.

G: It is indeed a matter of concern i agree,,, I have no idea whose site ranks highest and only someone with a monstrous ego would be at all concerned with whether he is more popular than Electronic Intifada. G: Again facts my dear,, i am sure that you know the ranking of your site and you also know that it jumps up when you write about me…and then it drops agin… ] you see , you have to learn to differentiate between ego and merits… What I do know is that EI is a site with quality articles on a consistent basis about Palestinian politics. Your site is full of rubbish. And if you don’t get it, well try this.

The Sun is Britain’s most popular paper and the News of the World was the most popular Sunday paper, but only a complete idiot would brandish those figures against the circulation of say the Guardian. Come to think of it you probably are a Sun reader. G: Popularity indeed doesn;t mean a lot, but as you and i know, all my articles are circulated on all and best dissident journals around the world in and in many languages… as you may know by now.. . You have a problem there, you will have to shape your narrative …. Going away for 3 weeks are we? Israel? No I guess that would be too obvious.

Just remember Harold Wilson’s dictum. Even a week can be a long time in politics. If I was u I’d keep internet contact.

Tony Greenstein

On 31 Jul 2011, at 02:42,

tony greenstein wrote: Not at all. If you have any relevant political question then I will be happy to answer it but I’m not going down into the sewer with you. The question is a simple one. Why did you refuse to give a simple answer to a question about the holocaust and instead dishonestly resort to saying you weren’t a historian? Actually it’s a rhetorical question since I know the answer. There is only one answer i.e. you didn’t want to say outright what you believe, i.e. there was no holocaust. So you were lying to the SWP in 2005 or you’ve changed your mind. Which is it? I’m published by plenty of quality publications and sites, from Electronic Intifada to Weekly Worker to the Journal of Holy Land Studies, Labour History Workshop etc.

They expect rigorous academic standards unlike the dross you pen which is motivated by conspiracy theories in which it’s always the the Jews wot done it. Sure there are hundreds of conspiracy sites and they are entitled to the benefit of your insights. You’re quite a simple fellow Gilad really. But I assume that when you go to Gabi’s conference you will be honest with those who wish to break the boundaries of political discourse and openly state what you think regarding WW2 and defy those who would want to silence the flat earthists, sorry holocaust deniers. Tony

Greenstein From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein

Sent: Sun, 31 July, 2011 8:43:05

Subject: Re: here is an offer Tony the offer was simple. You question , I question… But you are a coward …

You can mention my idf past but wouldn’t like to talk about yourself being a dedicated shoplifter more or less the same year. You see, you are not capable of think historically. People who cannot live in peace with their past ve no prospect of future. This applies to israel and you. Anyway. Here is the answer to your idiotic question. In spite of being an English speaker you fail to see that holocaust and nakba are not facts but historical narattives-compounds of facts, beliefs, myths, body of fictional and cinematic narration and so on… Hence the question ‘did the holocaust happen’ is an idiotic question and Impossible to answer. Narattives are not facts!!! The same applies to the Nakba. Facts can be verified in isolation not as a bundle of events… I guess that you are too stupid to understand it and this may not be your fault.

I believe also that there is no much you could do about it.. However, in my new book and my writing I give a full account of my take on history and the holcaust. History = revision of the past . The enemies of such adventure are the enemies of humanity. You amongst other zionists are no doubt in the club. Re the publications you mention. Only one of them is respected , credible and popular (elec intifada) and as far as I am aware you are not exactly their regular columnist… You probably managed to filter through twice… I wish you luck. You mayeven make it again in a year time… I wonder how come no one reprinted your Atzmon’s guide? you clearly spent years on this piece.

Have a nice day g On 31 Jul 2011, at 15:07, tony greenstein wrote: I’m not interested in a dialogue with you, your personal past, your failure to oppose Zionism when in Israel or any other mythology about you personally. i just want to know why you lie politically, that’s all. My personal past has no relevance to the debate despite your lies.

I’m not even interested in the fact that you have stolen the music and work of Palestinians and not given them credit or royalties except when pressed, eg Mahmoud Darwish. People will make their own assessment of your morals but for my part I’m not interested in you except in so far as you damage the Palestinian cause to boost your career Tony Greenstein 31st July 17:43 Tony Greenstein It’s not a question of what I believe. Oh I think most people know that even if I was Jack the Ripper himself, it would have no relevance to the fact that you are a holocaust denier and a liar who can’t even admit to what he believes openly. Someone who consciously lies like you is naturally politically dishonest so yes, obviously you r happy to take Palestinians for a ride to bolster your career. The question is whether you are an Israeli asset or not. The jury is out on that one.

tony greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein Sent: Sun, 31 July, 2011 17:56:25 Subject: Re: here is an offer It is not down to u to decide about the relevance of your past and it seems that was relevant enough for you to take me to court… the story about MD is almost as funny as your past… Do u really believe in it? Do u really believe that I would be publishing and touring for pls organisations if it was true? Even your stupidity must ve limit. Re: here is an offer From: Gilad Atzmon Sent: Sun, 31 July, 2011 22:54 …

To: tony greenstein >

U r a total moron to think that pls could boost anyone’s career.. Don’t u know that show business is run by z&js… The fact that I ve a career while supporting pls is a miracle xxx and re h denial, there is no such a thing. It is a zionist invention ..

From Tony Greenstein >

To: Gilad Atzmon

Monday 1st August 01.29.

Conference on Historical Revisionism

Gilad,

I realise that I didn’t response to the second part of your lengthy post, about which I have no complaint, because I didn’t see it. Put it down to the joys of bringing up children who distract you.

I understand only too well what you are saying. Historical narratives are either composed of historical facts, or alleged facts, or they are not historical. I say that as a historian. The debate in history centres around which facts are chosen out of the many, how they are interpreted and whether they are indeed true as alleged. You confuse a narrative with culture and in any event, the term historical narrative in the sense you use it is contradictory, as if history is just a story which can be changed.

Hence when Haneen Zoabi says that the Nakba is not a narrative but a fact she is challenging those who deny the Nakba. When I challenge those who deny the holocaust I do it for exactly the same reasons. When children were murdered in Auschwitz or in Duweima, they were facts – facts etched in blood. No narrative in the world can change those facts.

You say that the question whether the holocaust or nakba occurred is an ‘idiotic question and Impossible to answer. Narattives are not facts!!! The same applies to the Nakba.’ Precisely. Whether the holocaust or nakba occurred are facts, part of an overall story or analysis, but in themselves are factually situated in history.

The narrative or analysis is how we make sense of them, why did they happen, what were the attitudes of those who committed these atrocities, were they part of a wider plan, who knew etc. etc. Facts can clearly be verified as a bundle of events. If massacres occurred all round then it is likely that one occurred in a village or town, even where there were no survivors or witnesses.

So it is not a question of my stupidity but your desire to rewrite the past. History involves a reinterpreation of the past not a revision of the past . You can’t revise that which has happened unless you possess a time capsule. You can reinterpret the past but that is an entirely different thing. Hence why David Irving accepted the holocaust when he asserted that Hitler never knew. When he joined the holocaust deniers he was quickly out of his depth. So the enemies of humanity are those who would deny facts that have long been proved in order to repeat them again. I don’t know whether you are a Zionist. However everything you do gives comfort to them.

I have never claimed respectability. I was in fact asked specifically to write an article by EI on Histadrut and the process was rigorous. It has laid the basis for Boycott actions against them, not something you would know much about having opposed the boycott previously.

Interesting that the Journal of Holy Land Studies, edited by Professor Nur Masalha is not respected. But I only threw out these two to demonstrate that you are wrong as usual.

Tony Greenstein

On 1 Aug 2011, at 01:41,

tony greenstein wrote:

I’ll leave to one side your equation of Jews and Zionists and the fact that show business is run by them.
If indeed it is blighting your career, then we are in a win-win situation. You don’t associate with the Palestine solidarity movement and the Palestinians benefit. Likewise your career benefits. A deal?

Or of course there is the other explanation for your behaviour. Namely that your career is protected as a good Israeli State asset.

Tony Greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon giladatzmon@mac.com

To: tony greenstein

Sent: Mon, 1 August, 2011 7:54:04

Subject: Re: Conference on Historical Revisionism

I am sorry to disappoint you but history is a story.. It is an attempt to make the past into a story.. Sometime we encounter a battle between competing stories (stories , narratives, paradigms). I myself view it as the human experience.

And if a historical narrative is the ‘attempt to make sense’ if a chain of event’ as you yourself say than you cannot attribute truthfulness to it. You see, in order to attribute truth to a statement you need a correspondence rule. You can do it with facts but not with ‘sense’. about the attempt to make sense all you can say is that it is sensible…

You could do with a bit of thinking..this may help you to catch up …

Re: Conference on Historical Revisionism

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein <

Sent: Mon, 1 August, 2011 8:01:29

Subject: Re: here is an offer

Unlike you tony, I do not ve any interest in politics. I do what I do because I follow my own ethical call. I do not wake up in the morning and ask myself what I can do for ‘the movement’. I do what I do because I am intrigued intellectually and morally. I believe that the fact that each of my articles are reprinted an translated on hundreds of outlets means something. Everything is very simple in my world.

From: tony greenstein 14:03

To: Gilad Atzmon giladatzmon@mac.com

No history isn’t just a story. If when my children were younger I told them the story of the 3 Bears there was no truth in it. At best it was allegorical. But history is based on what actually happened, facts. Of course some history is invented, as Shlomo Sand has demonstrated. In which case it’s not history but myth.

Yes a historical narrative is an attempt to make sense of, sometimes conflicting facts.

What I really find strange is that you harp on about this absolute nonsense of whether or not the Holocaust occurred, when that is taken for granted, a given.

The real debates are not between historical revisionists and those who believe in the holocaust, because 99.99% of historians do, but within those who believe in it. That is why your attraction to the deniers is so churlish and childish. You never get beyond the first stage.

You therefore miss out on things like the devastating critique of Daniel Goldhagen’s attempt to portray all Germans as Hitler’s Willing Executioners. E.g. Finkelstein’s demolition job on him. What did Germans know, if anything? My own view is very little in fact, hence why no extermination camp was anywhere near Germany. It took the Germans 2 years to discover from 1939 to 1941 that even within Germany their own disabled children were being gassed and burnt in the ovens of Hartheim and Brandenburg.

Instead of having attached your kite to these non-historians who find a fact and then twist it into a general attack on the holocaust per se, as if e.g. one could ever be sure of numbers when it took the US 3 years to be confident it knew how many had died in 9/11, you could have written about the debates between intentionalists and functionalists, how Zionism via Yad vashem has sought to twist and manipulate holocaust historiography in their political direction erasing people like Rudolf Vrba.

Instead you wish to hold hands with Mark Weber of the IHR. That for me is what is most baffling.

Tony Greenstein

On 1 Aug 2011, at 14:54, tony greenstein < wrote:
whether you have any interest Gilad in politics the fact is that you are involved. Ethics are relative and yours are more relative than most.
The fact that your articles are reprinted means nothing. The question is who by. The News of the World was Britain’s biggest circulation newspaper, but its content was tripe.

Tony Greenstein

On 1 Aug 2011, at 15:03, tony greenstein wrote:

No history isn’t just a story. If when my children were younger I told them the story of the 3 Bears there was no truth in it. At best it was allegorical. But history is based on what actually happened, facts. Of course some history is invented, as Shlomo Sand has demonstrated. In which case it’s not history but myth.

Yes a historical narrative is an attempt to make sense of, sometimes conflicting facts.

What I really find strange is that you harp on about this absolute nonsense of whether or not the Holocaust occurred, when that is taken for granted, a given.

The real debates are not between historical revisionists and those who believe in the holocaust, because 99.99% of historians do, but within those who believe in it. That is why your attraction to the deniers is so churlish and childish. You never get beyond the first stage.

You therefore miss out on things like the devastating critique of Daniel Goldhagen’s attempt to portray all Germans as Hitler’s Willing Executioners. E.g. Finkelstein’s demolition job on him. What did Germans know, if anything? My own view is very little in fact, hence why no extermination camp was anywhere near Germany. It took the Germans 2 years to discover from 1939 to 1941 that even within Germany their own disabled children were being gassed and burnt in the ovens of Hartheim and Brandenburg.

Instead of having attached your kite to these non-historians who find a fact and then twist it into a general attack on the holocaust per se, as if e.g. one could ever be sure of numbers when it took the US 3 years to be confident it knew how many had died in 9/11, you could have written about the debates between intentionalists and functionalists, how Zionism via Yad vashem has sought to twist and manipulate holocaust historiography in their political direction erasing people like Rudolf Vrba.

Instead you wish to hold hands with Mark Weber. That for me is what is most baffling.

Tony Greenstein

From: Gilad Atzmon

To: tony greenstein

Date: Monday 1st August 15:31

We had been there before, you do not know how to integrate data into an argument. Indeed popularity is not necessarily an indication but my articles are circulated on most prestigious dissident Mags, they also do not promote any populist or popular views … if this doesn’t Mean a thing to you , I don’t know what does…, also ethics is not relative it Is actually universal… But this may be too complicated for you to grasp at this stage… It is one of the most complicated issues in continental philosophy .

From: Gilad Atzmon giladatzmon@mac.com

To: tony greenstein

Sent: Mon, 1 August, 2011 18:10:18

Subject: Re: Conference on Historical Revisionism

Tony did you ever hear about the distinction between fictional and non fictional..? If you really want to talk about sand , read sand about philosophy of history.. For him every history is an invention… I can send u a recording when he says it to me in an interview.. But he also says it in his book ..

Also you won’t fin in my writing any quote suggesting the H didn’t take place.. I insist that it is not conveyed as a historical narrative but as a religion .. The difference between leibovitch , offir and myself is that I try to understand the metaphysics of this precept ..
I am writing from phone and cannot enter a major discussion about DG or NF …but I clearly despise the former …I ll be happy to deal with it once I m on wifi

Posted in Politics1 Comment

Protests in IsraHell. Why and how much they matter.

NOVANEWS 

For personal reasons, I don’t have time to write the lengthy article that what is happening in Israel now deserves. But something is happening. There is an unprecedented wave of protests that are explicitly against neoliberalism, sweeping over Israel. They started from Tel Aviv but seem to be expanding to many cities. A few observations:

1. This is without a doubt the influence of the “Arab Spring.” While Israel has been one of the most viciously neo-liberalized societies in the Western world, and the level of pain inflicted cuts wide and deep, this wave of protests would have been unimaginable before Mubarak fell. The influence of the Arab Spring is clear in the mode of organizing, taking and holding public space; in the broad and (relative for Israel) non-sectarian demands and slogans; in the sheer size of participation, and in self-conscious references to the “Arab Spring”. The very fact that Israelis are emulating, and in some obvious ways, consciously emulating, a positive example set for them by Arab societies is psychologically momentous.

2. While this is not the first protest on matters of economic justice, to my knowledge this is the first “Israeli” large scale protest. By this I mean that struggles for social justice have been struggles of particularly hard hit sectors, while the majority watches with hostility, mild sympathy or indifference. This is not the case here. Furthermore, while the protesters seem to be declaring themselves apolitical, i.e. neither left nor right, one could say that precisely for this reason this is the first ever political protest in Israel. That is because the difference between “left” and “right” is not really a political difference in the sense that the “left” and the “right” do not have a fundamental disagreement about the future path of the Israeli society (they represent different cultural identities and only really disagree an the technical question of how to dispose of Palestinians). By putting those labels aside, the protesters are protesting, for the first time ever in Israel, as the people against the system. Therefore, this protest is the first emergence of a true political confrontation in Israel. This is simply momentous.

3. although the (small) radical left is almost invisible, reading between the lines it is clear that it plays a very important role, and yet that it does it with the wisdom of a light touch. This is, it seems to me, another example of emulating successful strategies from the Arab Spring.

4. The question is whether this wave of protest can become the kind of basis for a mass movement that would challenge the apartheid/settler dimension of Israel, given that this dimension is the heart of the state. It is the nature of radical events such as this protest movement that they are unpredictable and can go further than anyone can imagine. But bearing that in mind, my initial assessment is that it cannot. This is touching on one of the key differences between Israel and Egypt. In Egypt, the non-sectarianism of the original uprising was total. Since Israel is an apartheid state, the non-secterianism, while still impressive in its own terms, excludes the Palestinians, namely the most oppressed group within the system.

This cannot be easily overcome. The key contradiction is between the political dimension of the protest, which requires rejecting the language of “left” vs. “right”, and the absence of an Israeli language regarding Palestinians other than the degraded language of “left” vs. “right” Zionism (of course such a language exists, but it is not “Israeli”, and the people who can bring it are not part of it). What this means is that the very appearance of the apartheid issue on the scene of the protest would provide the government with the tools guaranteed to deflate it. Again, I wouldn’t say this is insurmountable, but chances are in won’t be surmounted.

This however does not mean the protest movement is insignificant. Even though at this stage it seems that it has neither the language, nor the social consciousness, to challenge apartheid, this protest movement challenges for the first time the deeper dimension of power that makes apartheid both necessary and possible. Any victory that it will have will therefore lead to more favorable conditions for challenging Israeli apartheid.

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Zio-Nazi Propaganda Spiking Palestine solidarity

NOVANEWS

I often divide anti-anti-zionists into two groups, knaves and fools. I haven’t read Spiked that much but what I had read was more foolish than knavish. Well Spinwatch has pulled all of the Spiked coverage of Palestine solidarity activism together and their hostility to Palestine solidarity looks too systematic to be mere foolery.

In a series of articles, Spiked writers have maligned activists using language as vituperative and categorical as the Israeli PR machine. The similarity between how the Israel lobby and Spiked describe the activists is remarkable: ‘a motley crew’ sporting a ‘weird mix of hippy, Islamist and imperialist sentiment,’ ‘a mish-mash of dinner-party liberals, radical Islamists and clapped-out left-wingers’, ‘Israel-bashers…European politicians, UN officials, left-wing activists, radical Islamists’)[1].

Neither is this an anomaly. Our investigation of Spiked’s output on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict reveals that elision of context (illegal occupation, creeping colonization, indiscriminate violence) and an obsessive focus on activists’ presumed motives are a perennial feature of its coverage. It therefore becomes important to ask how Spiked can maintain a contrarian veneer while reinforcing the suppositions of power.

The article’s potted history of Spiked is informative:

Spiked is a website set up in 2000 following the demise of its predecessor LMmagazine, which was shut down after a libel action by Independent Television News following a dispute over its coverage of the war in Bosnia. LM had previously (until December 1996) been known as Living Marxism. Started in 1988, it was published by the Revolutionary Communist Party (RCP), an ultra-left organisation widely reviled on the rest of the left (both radical and reformist) because of its sectarianism and relentless attacks on the left itself, as opposed to its claimed enemies: capitalism and imperialism. Its positions, while sometimes having some purchase in the abstract, were often perceived as an indication that the RCP were objectively agent provocateurs.

After the end of the Soviet bloc the party transformed itself, dropping Marxism in 1996—it thought the working class were not up to the job, thus the RCP dissolved them as an agent of history—along with the party name.[2] Between 1997 and 2000, the core of the party continued to organise together under the banner of LM magazine as a propaganda group promoting increasingly libertarian ideas. It has been well documented that they became very close to the libertarian right, opposing the green movement and allying with pro-corporate sceptics and Thatcherite free market think tanks on tobacco, climate, GM, food, alcohol and many other issues.[3]

Spiked emerged from the aftermath of the LM closure with another organisation called the Institute of Ideas; both remain based in the offices formerly occupied by Living Marxism/LM. They are still run by a core of interlocking personnel, almost all of whom were cadre of the RCP and include, in a variety of key roles, the former leader of the RCP and continuing guru, Frank Furedi, professor of Sociology at the University of Kent. This and the habit of creating a network of closely linked front groups, spin-offs and other ventures, with overlapping membership has led to them being dubbed the ‘LM network’.

They pursued and received corporate funding from the pharma, oil, food, alcohol  and other industries, including from Pfizer, Shell and Cadbury-Schweppes, whose activities are often criticised as harmful to public health and wellbeing or whose interests are threatened by activist campaigns. They also took support in cash or kind from controversial public relations firms such as Hill and KnowltonLuther Pendragon and TechCentralStation.[4]

This is another thing I got wrong about these rightists who talk leftish. I always think that their bogus politics are broadly linked to interests, not directly bought and paid for. Of course the broad interest thing holds for many bloggers, journos and academics but Spiked appears to have taken “the next step”.

For the sake of completeness, here are the footnotes:

[1] Brendan O’Neill, ‘Gaza flotilla: invasion of the moral armada,’ Spiked, 2 June 2010; Brendan O’Neill, ‘The antithesis of anti-imperialism,’ Spiked, 6 January 2009.

[2] Dave Renton, ‘The new socialism of fools,’ DKRenton.co.uk, 7 February 2006; Renton, ‘Living Marxism, spiked online and the RCP,’ DKRenton.co.uk, 4-8 March 2006.
[3]George Monbiot, ‘Far Left or Far Right?: Living Marxism’s interesting allegiances,’Prospect, 1 November 1998;George Monbiot, ‘Flying Over the Cuckoo’s Nest,’ The Guardian, 13 January 2009;  Jenny Turner, Who Are They?, London Review of Books, 8 July 2010; Helge Ogrim, ‘Battle of Ideas, is the Revolutionary Communist Party still the vanguard?’ Norwegian Affairs, 6 November 2010.

[4] Spiked ‘Sponsorship packages’, http://www.spiked-online.com/index.php/about/article/340/

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Pakistan: Enforcing diplomatic norms

NOVANEWS

 

 

If Pakistan has taken the step of asking a specific mission in Islamabad to reduce its members, it is supported by Article 11 of the Vienna Convention that states that in the absence of specific agreement as to the size of the mission, the receiving State may require that the size of a mission be kept within limits considered by it to be reasonable and normal, having regard to circumstances and conditions in the receiving State and to the needs of the particular mission.

By S. M. Hali

 The government of Pakistan has imposed new travel restrictions on all diplomats accredited to the country. The move comes in the backdrop of a number of diplomats abusing the hospitality of the host country. Although the diplomatic norms and practices are ancient and have been recognized by every state, they have been codified in the 1961 Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations to remove confusion and doubt as to what diplomatic agents can or cannot do in a host country.

Pertinent to the current situation in Pakistan, Article 41 of the Vienna Convention specifies that without prejudice to their privileges and immunities, it is the duty of all persons enjoying such privileges and immunities to respect the laws and regulations of the receiving State. They also have a duty not to interfere in the internal affairs of that State. All official business with the receiving State entrusted to the mission by the sending State shall be conducted with or through the Ministry for Foreign Affairs of the receiving State or such other ministry as may be agreed. The premises of the mission must not be used in any manner incompatible with the functions of the mission as laid down in the present Convention or by other rules of general international law or by any special agreements in force between the sending and the receiving State.

Unfortunately, Pakistan was being taken for granted and a number of diplomats were acting in total contravention of the spirit of Article 41 described above. Pakistan has been harmed by the undiplomatic practices of certain diplomats and it has become imperative to bridle the activities of some of these unrestrained diplomats.

An important principle incorporated in the preamble of the Vienna Convention is the “sovereign equality of states” as enshrined in the UN Charter, which provides states to deal with their external and internal affairs without outside interference for promoting their national interests and to defend its territorial integrity of states. The term “sovereign equality of states” is not a cliché. It is the attribute of basic building blocks of international community underscored by the League of Nations and its successor, the UN.

Pakistan’s sovereignty was breached when US “diplomats” enabled the clandestine operation Geronimo conducted by US Navy SEALS to capture and kill Osama bin Laden. Raymond Davis, a CIA operative was caught red handed being engaged in anti state activities, carrying illegal weapons, conducting espionage on Pakistan’s vulnerable assets and murdering two Pakistanis in cold blood. However, the US State Department as well as the US President insisted that Raymond Davis was a “diplomat” and enjoyed diplomatic immunity.

A number of foreign diplomats have been observed engaging in activities, which in any diplomatic parlance cannot be described as acceptable norms. Pakistan has suffered enough in the war against terror, where agents from various countries have been moving freely, contacting enemies of the state, including Al-Qaeda and Taliban operatives. The US Operation Geronimo was also conducted with the help of local agents of the CIA, who had been recruited by the so called “diplomats”.

This worsening state of affairs, which brinks on waging a covert war against the state of Pakistan left no option but to restrict the movement of the diplomats. Pakistan Foreign Ministry has specifically stated that the increased limitations on when and how diplomats can move outside the capital is not US-Specific. There are general guidelines regarding travel of Pakistan-based diplomats, designed only to ensure their safety and security, which have existed for a long time, and enforcing them now should not be construed as targeting the US or any specific country.

If Pakistan has taken the step of asking a specific mission in Islamabad to reduce its members, it is supported by Article 11 of the Vienna Convention that states that in the absence of specific agreement as to the size of the mission, the receiving State may require that the size of a mission be kept within limits considered by it to be reasonable and normal, having regard to circumstances and conditions in the receiving State and to the needs of the particular mission. The receiving State may equally, within similar bounds and on a non-discriminatory basis, refuse to accept officials of a particular category.

Hence if the sender country insists on sending members of its intelligence agencies under the cover of “diplomats”, Pakistan is well within its rights to refuse them that status. It has thus become imperative to enforce diplomatic norms in the supreme interest of the sovereignty of Pakistan.

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Drone Usage on the Rise in Conflicts Worldwide

By German Radio

Drones are becoming more widespread throughout the world – be it in Pakistan, Iraq, in Yemen or Somalia. These unmanned planes, currently mainly piloted remotely, may eventually engage each other on their own.

On Thursday, Iranian and Indian media reported that an American drone strike had killed four militants in the North Waziristan region of Pakistan. Over in Europe, also on Thursday, the French Ministry of Defensesaid it was in talks with a military contractor to order a new fleet of drones that could be deployed as soon as 2014.

Meanwhile, across the globe, on the very same day, the police chief in the Australian capital, Canberra, told Australian media that he was considering deploying surveillance drones across his city’s skies.

Over the last few years, drones have become an indispensible part of the American campaign to combat terrorism in various parts of the world, and also are starting to trickle into law enforcement tactics worldwide as well.

Major increase in drone attacks
The United States has especially increased its use of drones in Pakistan. Between 2004 and 2007 there were just nine drone attacks. In 2008 it was 33, the next year it was 53 and last year the attacks hit 118.

The estimates about the number of fatalities from these attacks range from 600 to almost 1,000.

“I can’t imagine that the USA would launch this many manned air attacks in Pakistan,” said Jürgen Altmann, in an interview with Deutsche Welle.

The University of Dortmund physicist is a founding member of the International Committee for Robot Arms Control (ICRAC), a non-profit organization that advocates for a re-evaluation of automated war technologies, like drones.

The fact that these planes are relatively small and have no crew on board makes it easier for Pakistan’s government to allow them, Altmann said.

“[The] threshold for the involvement of unmanned drones in conflict is lower, as when manned planes are involved,” he said.

War without risk?
The enormous increase in computer power, new camera and sensor technology has made it possible to run a war without risk to one’s soldiers.

Noel Sharkey, a professor of artificial intelligence and robotics at the University of Sheffield in the United Kingdom, said the new development isn’t just dangerous for civilians living in enemy territory.

“It is also dangerous for our own civilians, because lopsided wars lead to new terrorism,” he noted. “People won’t just give up because we’ve got the best technology.”

The case for drones?
A worldwide drone arms race is well and truly underway. Some 50 states have already bought drones for surveillance – including countries like Israel, Germany, China, Russia and Iran. Many of these nations are working on armed drones as well.

Drone proponents argue that the money saved in comparison to normal fighter jets is considerable: a US MQ 9 drone costs only $10 million (7.05 million euros) and can be loaded up with 14 Hellfire rockets. By comparison, a F-22 fighter jet costs around $150 million (105.8 million euros). Plus, the training for the drone pilots also costs much less than training for a traditional jet pilot.

Plus, others have argued that a drone’s inability to become emotionally inflamed might be a possible argument for the increased use of drones.

“Robots don’t get angry when their fellow soldiers get killed,” said Peter Warren Singer, an analyst at the American think-tank, the Brookings Institution, and the author of the 2009 book, “Wired for War.”

“They don’t commit any crime due out of revenge or retaliation – that’s one of the reasons why war crimes are committed,” he told Deutsche Welle. “But for a robot an 80-year-old grandmother is the same as a tank. Both are just a combination of zeros and ones.”

An ethical robot
Similarly, Ronald Arkin, a professor of robotics at the Georgia Institute of Technology, believes that robots’ unemotional operating methods as a strength.

Arkin is convinced that systems can be developed which will be better than humans on the battle field – he argues that it may be possible to program a robot with the rules of the Geneva Conventions. This would mean they could refuse to carry out some orders which contradict the rules of international conflict and rules of engagement.

However, not all roboticists are convinced of the ability to reduce human ethics into software.

“Because no-one knows what it means to bring in ethical considerations into programming,” said Hans-Jörg Kreowsky, a professor of computer science at the University of Bremen. “Ethics can’t be defined by algorithms, that means you can’t build it.”

Read more: http://www.defencetalk.com/drone-usage-on-the-rise-in-conflicts-worldwide-35878/#ixzz1Tx9B6RUo

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Opposition Condemns Suspected Saudi Tanks Deal

NOVANEWS

A former German cabinet minister has joined the opposition Greens in criticizing Berlin for a suspected tanks deal with Saudi Arabia. The Greens have initiated legal proceedings to force Berlin to confirm the sale.

Former development minister, Heidemarie Wieczorek-Zeul, spoke out against the German government on Monday for the suspected sale of 200 “Leopard” combat tanks to the Saudi government.

The Berliner Zeitung newspaper reported that Wieczorek-Zeul accused the government of hypocrisy. “The tank deal with Saudi Arabia is a catastrophic decision,” she said. In selling the tanks, Germany has “supported an authoritarian, despotic regime.”

This policy “is the exact opposite of the government’s public stance on the democratic uprisings in the Arab World,” Wieczorek-Zeul added.

She called on German Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle to justify conducting a secret arms deal while publicly supporting the democracy movementin Egypt.

Court complaint
Wieczorek-Zeul’s comments came just a day after Germany’s opposition Green party announced it had launched a complaint with the country’s highest court, over the sale of the tanks.

German news magazine Spiegel reported Sunday that Green party leaders had filed a motion with the Constitutional Court, demanding that information over the deal be made public.

Reports of the sale have been published by several news organizations, but the German government has so far refused to comment on the basis of national security.

The Greens argued this position is untenable as the alleged deal has been in the public sphere for weeks. Deputy party leader, Hans-Christian Ströbele told Spiegel that even if confidentiality was justifiable, information must be relayed to parliament.

Until now, it has been German government policy not to export heavy weapons to the authoritarian regime in Saudi Arabia.

Read more: http://www.defencetalk.com/opposition-condemns-suspected-saudi-tanks-deal-36080/#ixzz1Tx8HE3uT

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